National News Sarah Everard

Wallop said:
The main question for me is what can be done to better protect innocent people. The answer I’m afraid is very little. There will always be psychopaths, terrorists, sexual deviants, schizophrenic people etc. out there and they will be the last ones to adhere to any reactionary rules if they are brought in. All you can do is try to minimize your risk by trying to avoid situations where you might be vulnerable but even that might not be enough if you are in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I’m sure Lee Rigby felt he was in no danger shortly before he was murdered. Harold Shipman’s victims died at the hands of an individual that they would have had total trust in.

I don’t think there are any simple answers here.
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Very true. But simply calling out the misogynistic sexist verbal insults women suffer each day is a start. I'm sure some young men grow up kind of knowing this is wrong but go along with it because their mates do it until it becomes so ingrained they insult on autopilot not realising the damage they do or the fear they generate.
 
QR said:
Ok thanks so now we wait and see which sickening offence(s) she did commit to merit this response. Gonna be interesting.
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Look her up on your favourite social media platform.

None of us will know the truth...... she`ll have the media "on side"...... actress and professional agitator it seems.

Was subsequently released with a covid fine, quick brush of the hair, recovered from the "trauma" and straight into the (scripted) interviews.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1370899755786702849
 
QR said:
Very true. But simply calling out the misogynistic sexist verbal insults women suffer each day is a start. I'm sure some young men grow up kind of knowing this is wrong but go along with it because their mates do it until it becomes so ingrained they insult on autopilot not realising the damage they do or the fear they generate.
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Speak for yourself if you go about your day making misogynistic, sexist verbal insults to women.

I don`t.
 
QR said:
Very true. But simply calling out the misogynistic sexist verbal insults women suffer each day is a start. I'm sure some young men grow up kind of knowing this is wrong but go along with it because their mates do it until it becomes so ingrained they insult on autopilot not realising the damage they do or the fear they generate.
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Essexyellows said:
Speak for yourself if you go about your day making misogynistic, sexist verbal insults to women.

I don`t.
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Or do as @Essexyellows and ignore the problem.
 
Priti Patel, the home secretary, demanded a report from the Met that was provided on Sunday but left “questions to be answered”, a spokesperson said. A Home Office source said: “By definition if she was satisfied, there would not be questions remaining.”

I suppose the questions could be 'why weren't more people arrested'?
 
Scotchegg said:
The woman shown being arrested has not been charged with pushing, barging, punching, spitting, resisting arrest, carrying an offensive weapon etc. She was given a fixed penalty notice for covid breaches, which I pretty sure doesn't warrant bring forcibly restrained.
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I think you (and people on social media) are exaggerating what happened to her, she was arrested in a prone position which is common when people are struggling, she wasn’t kneeled on as that would have caused her some injury, she was absolutely fine afterwards. It was hardly an assault or police brutality.
 
QR said:
Or do as @Essexyellows and ignore the problem.
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And where did I say that then?

Typical cancel culture response....... if you don`t agree with "insert -ism here" you are the problem.

When you grow up and have gained life experience you to will become wiser.
 
Scotchegg said:
The woman shown being arrested has not been charged with pushing, barging, punching, spitting, resisting arrest, carrying an offensive weapon etc. She was given a fixed penalty notice for covid breaches, which I pretty sure doesn't warrant bring forcibly restrained.
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As you will know, grounds for arrest differ from sufficient evidence to charge.
 
Eaststanding said:
As you will know, grounds for arrest differ from sufficient evidence to charge.
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Of course, but seeing as the arrest was captured by a thousand cameras, I'm pretty sure there would have been one single image of her pushing, punching, spitting etc. So let's cut all the rubbish about her being a threat to the police - she wasn't.

But she was in breach of covid regulations, and passively non-compliant. The police have the right to use force to gain compliance when carrying out a lawful order, or to make an arrest. But it must be necessary and proportionate. I would say, from what I've seen, that neither were the case. She was much smaller in height and size than the arresting officers. She was not resisting and presented no flight risk. She was unarmed (we would have heard if she was!) and wasn't verbally or physically threatening. So why put someone facedown on the floor, a position that significantly increases risk to those involved, to put handcuffs on when they could have easily been applied whilst standing?

However you look it, the decision to move in and start using force to move peaceful protesters/mourners from a safe and respectful place was incredibly badly thought out and is being condemned by people from all political parties.
 
Concretebob said:
I'm worried this is going to turn into "us versus the police" and "women versus men"
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When you train society to split into teams and fight each other for as long as we have in this country, it inevitably spills over into every area and every aspect of life. You can’t condition people to be angry at each other and to fight and argue until they’re blue in the face 24/7 and then expect there to be any sense of control over where that aggression is trained. After a while you just have a bunch of seriously pissed off people wanting to take on another bunch of seriously pissed off people. It’s the same as the Covid conspiracists and the anti-vaxxers. Telling people they can make their own truth and decide what’s real and what isn’t based on their own desires, and that facts and evidence don’t really exist, created the environment for it all to thrive. So I would say that what you’re worried about will almost certainly happen, unfortunately, because you can’t keep encouraging society to set fire to everything in the name of ‘winning’ without it eventually becoming the default course of action. Everybody is completely and utterly furious, all the time. The policing bill that is being jammed through parliament in the coming days won’t do much to help, because obviously when everyone is angry the best thing to do is try to put them in a cage and gag them by force.

Game’s gone, Jeff. I don’t know what the answer is.
 
RyanioBirdio said:
When you train society to split into teams and fight each other for as long as we have in this country, it inevitably spills over into every area and every aspect of life. You can’t condition people to be angry at each other and to fight and argue until they’re blue in the face 24/7 and then expect there to be any sense of control over where that aggression is trained. After a while you just have a bunch of seriously pissed off people wanting to take on another bunch of seriously pissed off people. It’s the same as the Covid conspiracists and the anti-vaxxers. Telling people they can make their own truth and decide what’s real and what isn’t based on their own desires, and that facts and evidence don’t really exist, created the environment for it all to thrive. So I would say that what you’re worried about will almost certainly happen, unfortunately, because you can’t keep encouraging society to set fire to everything in the name of ‘winning’ without it eventually becoming the default course of action. Everybody is completely and utterly furious, all the time. The policing bill that is being jammed through parliament in the coming days won’t do much to help, because obviously when everyone is angry the best thing to do is try to put them in a cage and gag them by force.

Game’s gone, Jeff. I don’t know what the answer is.
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Wow that's, detailed...

Points well made Ryan.
 
Scotchegg said:
Of course, but seeing as the arrest was captured by a thousand cameras, I'm pretty sure there would have been one single image of her pushing, punching, spitting etc. So let's cut all the rubbish about her being a threat to the police - she wasn't.

But she was in breach of covid regulations, and passively non-compliant. The police have the right to use force to gain compliance when carrying out a lawful order, or to make an arrest. But it must be necessary and proportionate. I would say, from what I've seen, that neither were the case. She was much smaller in height and size than the arresting officers. She was not resisting and presented no flight risk. She was unarmed (we would have heard if she was!) and wasn't verbally or physically threatening. So why put someone facedown on the floor, a position that significantly increases risk to those involved, to put handcuffs on when they could have easily been applied whilst standing?

However you look it, the decision to move in and start using force to move peaceful protesters/mourners from a safe and respectful place was incredibly badly thought out and is being condemned by people from all political parties.
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What footage have you seen?
 
Scotchegg said:
It was on the BBC this morning. I'll look up a link if I can.
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No need. Does that or any other piece of footage show the physical abuse aimed at officers, spitting at officers trying to move people on from their unlawful protest, the damage to a police van, physically assaulting officers trying to arrest protesters?
I don’t know who did what but peaceful it was not once the protest started.
As for this,; ‘However you look it, the decision to move in and start using force to move peaceful protesters/mourners from a safe and respectful place was incredibly badly thought out’.
Use any kind of touchy feely language you want, but this was not peaceful.
Bottom line is it’s Sarah’s family and their view of the so called ‘peaceful vigil’ that are in my thoughts, not the idiots that decided that Covid is over and that attacking the police was okay.
 
Eaststanding said:
No need. Does that or any other piece of footage show the physical abuse aimed at officers, spitting at officers trying to move people on from their unlawful protest, the damage to a police van, physically assaulting officers trying to arrest protesters?
I don’t know who did what but peaceful it was not once the protest started.
As for this,; ‘However you look it, the decision to move in and start using force to move peaceful protesters/mourners from a safe and respectful place was incredibly badly thought out’.
Use any kind of touchy feely language you want, but this was not peaceful.
Bottom line is it’s Sarah’s family and their view of the so called ‘peaceful vigil’ that are in my thoughts, not the idiots that decided that Covid is over and that attacking the police was okay.
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Please provide any evidence of physical abuse, spitting, assaults or criminal damage.

Anything to support your assessment that this was idiots attacking the police?

Because without any evidence to the contrary, we are left with images of women being pushed and restrained by predominantly male police officers at an event to highlight the vulnerability of women in society. Disagreeing with that narrative is one thing, but making up assumptions or inventing events to justify these actions is actually a little shameful.
 
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