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[SteMerritt]

It's not ridiculous at all. It's exactly the same - it's paying into a system based on a chance that you may eventually use it. Whether that's for a car or your health doesn't matter, the concept is the same.

I don't necessarily object to the NHS, but the idea everyone's a 'winner' is a bit silly. In no other context would you say you've 'won' by overpaying for a service.

I think we have a fundamentally different view on how a society should work, which is fine. As you said in a post earlier, there isn't a society around which will satisfy everyone. I definitely think everyone wins with the NHS, despite its numerous faults.

 

[Grumpy Git]

Where do you get this s**t from?

The Idiots guide to Tory excuses. How to blame the oiks.

 

[Wandering Yellow]

Where do you get this s**t from?

Whenever you bring up failed socialist states to professed socialists you always get the same answer.

 

[Wandering Yellow]

Not all "socialism" is bad. The NHS for instance.

In principle I agree with you. Some things should be run in the interest of the countries inhabitants rather than in interest of profit, a prime example of me for that would be train networks.

Socialism is a bad way to run a society and that has been proven numerous times throughout history.

 

[m]

Whenever you bring up failed socialist states to professed socialists you always get the same answer.

What an absolute load of B*****s.

 

[Wandering Yellow]

What an absolute load of B*****s.

Such a mature and well-thought out response.

Socialists are the same as hard-core tories. When socialism fails = not real socialism
When tories fail = not real conservatism/ tory values

Just as bad as each other

 

[m]

Such a mature and well-thought out response.

Socialists are the same as hard-core tories. When socialism fails = not real socialism
When tories fail = not real conservatism/ tory values

Just as bad as each other

It's exactly the level of response that your sloganeering and stereotyping deserves.

For someone who claims to be a victim of stereotyping you are incredibly eager to dish it out.

Some lefties are dickheads, some on the right are too. I don't think this is news for most people.

 

[tonyw]

It's not ridiculous at all. It's exactly the same - it's paying into a system based on a chance that you may eventually use it. Whether that's for a car or your health doesn't matter, the concept is the same.

I don't necessarily object to the NHS, but the idea everyone's a 'winner' is a bit silly. In no other context would you say you've 'won' by overpaying for a service.

Even in the US, this is true - individuals buy their own health insurance (or their employers buy it for them) and then use more or less of the service than they have paid for depending on how sick they get.

But there's no other way you can run a healthcare system - if everyone just paid for what they used, then a rare cancer diagnosis or similar would be a death sentence because nobody other than the top fraction of a percent of earners would be able to afford the treatment. By collectively paying for the healthcare of all (in the UK) or most (in the US), we enable everyone to get healthcare based on need rather than wealth. And unless you're Jeff Bezos or Elon Musk, having such a system should give you comfort that a safety net exists, thus making you a 'winner'.

The big difference between the NHS and the US healthcare system (with most other major wealthy nations being somewhere in the middle) is that because Britain doesn't have to pay for half a million people working in the healthcare insurance and billing industry, and because having a single entity paying for drugs and equipment shifts the supply/demand economics in the NHS' favour, healthcare in the UK is comparatively incredibly cheap.

 

[QR]

It's not ridiculous at all. It's exactly the same - it's paying into a system based on a chance that you may eventually use it. Whether that's for a car or your health doesn't matter, the concept is the same.

I don't necessarily object to the NHS, but the idea everyone's a 'winner' is a bit silly. In no other context would you say you've 'won' by overpaying for a service.

That fact that if you have a heart attack tomorrow, it it there for you, free of charge, means you're a winner now.

 

[Wandering Yellow]

It's exactly the level of response that your sloganeering and stereotyping deserves.

For someone who claims to be a victim of stereotyping you are incredibly eager to dish it out.

Some lefties are dickheads, some on the right are too. I don't think this is news for most people.

Your ilk stereotype "tories/right wingers" on here all the time and I've never seen you complain about it once.

I hear often in the media cries of "real socialism has never been tried"

 

[Scotchegg]

I don't necessarily have an issue with it either, I just don't agree that if I finish my life paying more than what I receive that I've 'won' - I've simply just lost money and ultimately overpaid for a service.

It takes some doing to be more ignorant and selfish than Essex, but I think you've managed it.

If I get to the end of my life without the need for medical support and recieve less out of the NHS than I've put in, then I'll consider myself very lucky and a winner.

Because my contribution could have been used to treat a child with cancer, or to have paid for an AIDS test for a rape victim, paid for the defib that was needed to save a fellow Oxford fan at the Wycombe game a couple of years ago, or to have help provide hospice care for someone in their last days. Or any one of the millions of other interventions the NHS covers every year.

It's not perfect, but the NHS provides the same care to everyone based on need not your bank balance, and that makes us all winners.

 

[Wandering Yellow]

It takes some doing to be more ignorant and selfish than Essex, but I think you've managed it.

If I get to the end of my life without the need for medical support and recieve less out of the NHS than I've put in, then I'll consider myself very lucky and a winner.

Because my contribution could have been used to treat a child with cancer, or to have paid for an AIDS test for a rape victim, paid for the defib that was needed to save a fellow Oxford fan at the Wycombe game a couple of years ago, or to have help provide hospice care for someone in their last days. Or any one of the millions of other interventions the NHS covers every year.

It's not perfect, but the NHS provides the same care to everyone based on need not your bank balance, and that makes us all winners.

I'm sure Essex has a thick skin, but there's no need for that is there?

 

[Big Ron]

I'm sure Essex has a thick skin, but there's no need for that is there?

As a man who has admitted to trolling on here and who stands up for himself, I'm sure EY won't be in the least bit bothered.

I usually try to ignore most of your posts after our previous run-ins , but christ you are posting some rambling s**t at the moment and then seemingly taking an indignant stance. If you trying to provoke a reaction, don't be surprised when you actually get one.

 

[Scotchegg]

I'm sure Essex has a thick skin, but there's no need for that is there?

Seems like you've picked on the most important point!!

 

[m]

Your ilk stereotype "tories/right wingers" on here all the time and I've never seen you complain about it once.

Come on, you're barely even trying anymore!

 

[SteMerritt]

Your ilk stereotype "tories/right wingers" on here all the time and I've never seen you complain about it once.

I hear often in the media cries of "real socialism has never been tried"

It isn't just the right who get a rebust argument on here, the left do as well. I don't think you were on here when a poster called YellowTaxi (I think) was posting a lot of far left views around the time of the GE that Corbyn fought, they received some strong arguments as well. The reason you perceive an imbalance is because there isn't much of an active Left on here.

 

[Eric Blair]

Also there isn’t just one type of socialism. I’d put myself down as a social democrat - higher taxes to pay for services we all need. To say socialism (or social democracy) doesn’t work is to ignore most of the Nordic countries

 

[Eric Blair]

Also this is getting embarrassing but can we elect @Scotchegg to some sort of national office?

 

[Eric Blair]

Also this is getting embarrassing but can we elect @Scotchegg to some sort of national office?

Actually @Scotchegg and @QR in coalition

 

[RyanioBirdio]

Also this is getting embarrassing but can we elect @Scotchegg to some sort of national office?

Eric I swear to God I’m going to f*****g prolapse if you carry on.