Matches Top 6 Race 2023/24

[Steve Gilbert]

But you come from the same class as Egg where anything less than positivity when things are good is totally unfathomable, ridiculous, laughable. If any one of the more critical posters had said what you’ve said while second in the league you’d have ridiculed them. But it’s ok now he’s a pantomime villain?

We were winning games. It wasn’t swashbuckling attacking football but it was still a side licking wounds from an awful season and still shy on headcount. Manning tended to box smart and sit behind the jab. Maybe that’s all he felt he could do with what he had and that’s hard to argue with since Des has tried to open us up and regressed the team.

It’s ok to be pissed off/disappointed/critical of him leaving if you so wish but I just can’t understand how you can take away what he did with the team.

No I tended to always find Manning’s style of football quite boring to watch but it is also a results business so I was happy we were picking up results.
You can be happy with winning while being bored watching it, just like I found the pompey game exciting to watch but disappointed we lost.

 

[ttg17]

But you come from the same class as Egg where anything less than positivity when things are good is totally unfathomable, ridiculous, laughable. If any one of the more critical posters had said what you’ve said while second in the league you’d have ridiculed them. But it’s ok now he’s a pantomime villain?

We were winning games. It wasn’t swashbuckling attacking football but it was still a side licking wounds from an awful season and still shy on headcount. Manning tended to box smart and sit behind the jab. Maybe that’s all he felt he could do with what he had and that’s hard to argue with since Des has tried to open us up and regressed the team.

It’s ok to be pissed off/disappointed/critical of him leaving if you so wish but I just can’t understand how you can take away what he did with the team.

Really sorry but I don't know why certain posters, I'm afraid yourself included, seem to feel the need to turn every thread into a binary 'Manning Good Buckingham Bad' mudslinging. All the points have been done to death, let's leave it for this thread eh? I love these kinds of threads at the ends of seasons, where al lthe permutations can be properly chewed over, really adds to the sense of excitement and intrigue going into every match day. Let's not turn it into another one with the same tedious arguments that have happened on every thread for the last 4 months.

 

[Bicester Yellow]

If Manning stayed we’d of been comfortably in the play offs.

Who knows we could’ve challenged Pompey/Derby..

A lot of that would’ve been decided by how he got his January transfer window done.

He was an outstanding manager here.

From what I’ve heard, the signings we made in January were signings Manning & Waldron had identified anyway.

 

[Barbadosyellow]

Why do we have a 10% chance of winning a four team play off?

Just my personal view of the chances of beating Bolton over two legs and then Barnsley or Peterborough at Wembley. If you take the view that the playoffs are a lottery so everyone has a 25% chance of winning we would have a one in eight chance of promotion. Maybe that's more realistic?

 

[Leysboy]

I was never ‘excited’ when watching Manning’s style of football. I actually found it quite boring but saw that it was affective and got results.

As has been said many times, we out performed our XG and stats showed that we were doing better than we should have.

You clearly didn’t go to Derby, Barnsley and Fleetwood.

We were fantastic, we strangled teams, and had a high press. The opposition had big trouble dealing with it, and it yielded positive results.

This was the weakest Lge 1 we’ve had since we joined, and with a January window I’m confident enough to say we would be 10 points better off, than we are now.

He left in pretty unprofessional circumstances, but give the man credit, he did a very good job, with the players he had at his disposal.

I’d have him back tomorrow!

 

[dickwalton1964]

You clearly didn’t go to Derby, Barnsley and Fleetwood.

We were fantastic, we strangled teams, and had a high press. The opposition had big trouble dealing with it, and it yielded positive results.

This was the weakest Lge 1 we’ve had since we joined, and with a January window I’m confident enough to say we would be 10 points better off, than we are now.

He left in pretty unprofessional circumstances, but give the man credit, he did a very good job, with the plays he had at his disposal.

I’d have him back tomorrow!

I think people forget he guided us to safety the previous season too. Ok, we had a favourable run in and he perhaps should have been expected to but there was still a job to be done and he did it without too much drama. I certainly wasn’t blown away by his playing style this season, it wasn’t edge of your seat stuff, but it was yielding results. In my opinion, Manning was one of the clearest thinking and unmuddled, managers we’ve had in recent times.

His recruitment in the summer was good, he told us it would be done in good time and also said one or two would be last minute - everything fell nicely in to place. Come August the work over pre season was crystal clear and his mark was clearly imprinted on the team. His interviews were a bit bland but again there was a calmness and logic in pretty much everything he said.

His departure was untimely but I don’t blame him - it was a career move he couldn’t turn down. It may even have been one of those scenarios where he might even have wished Bristol City went away and didn’t give him a decision to make but once he was their man he was always off. Like you, I’d have him back tomorrow too.

 

[Swaby39]

Really sorry but I don't know why certain posters, I'm afraid yourself included, seem to feel the need to turn every thread into a binary 'Manning Good Buckingham Bad' mudslinging. All the points have been done to death, let's leave it for this thread eh? I love these kinds of threads at the ends of seasons, where al lthe permutations can be properly chewed over, really adds to the sense of excitement and intrigue going into every match day. Let's not turn it into another one with the same tedious arguments that have happened on every thread for the last 4 months.

Fair enough

 

[Osleroad]

Bristol City lot quite happy to drive him to us atm - no-one could have predicted Mills injury or Beadle ditching out so soon either but the fact that players identified still wanted to come here in Jan says something even with DB in charge. We were seriously derailed by several things inc LM departure and the fact we are still in the promo conversation also says something. No team was going to hand us 2nd place on a plate as much as we were dumped out of all other competitions.

 

[Sheik djibouti]

Wonder how much the loss of Beadle has meant in points

I also wonder how many points we've lost due to our best 11 not being available for large parts of the season, and especially from November onwards.

I always thought that our squad was particularly thin behind the first choice players. And that was long before Manning left. There seemed to be an acceptance when he arrived that it would take 3 windows to undo years of Robinson and his neglect to address some fundamental weaknesses while he massaged his own ego trying to resurrect numerous players careers....until he got bored of them that is.

Manning's failure to adequately address striking options being the most glaring issue. We've seen time and again over the years that it's a very difficult position to fill, so I'd cut him some slack on that front, but we were nowhere near being the finished article this season and we're particularly lacking much strength in depth.

If it's right that most of our January options were lined up prior to his departure, then maybe Goodwin was his signing all along. Great option on paper, but it hasn't worked out as we'd hoped from the start because we seemingly picked up an underlying issue that had gone undetected by Cheltenham. We nevertheless went ahead with the deal, probably because we thought it was something that could be overcome with the right rehabilitation and owing to his age. Maybe the final deal was changed to reflect this, which might explain why the deal took most of January to agree.

Anyway, I like the sound of the prediction up the thread that has us in 6th and Lincoln in 7th going into the final game. I fancy us to get more against Exeter than I do them against Pompey!

 

[RgYellows]

I was never ‘excited’ when watching Manning’s style of football. I actually found it quite boring but saw that it was affective and got results.

But what you felt isn’t a universal truth. I am not “pretending” that I loved the football at the start of the season. It was the perfect antidote for anyone who had had enough of Robinson.

As has been said many times, we out performed our XG and stats showed that we were doing better than we should have.

I’m not sure that repeating points said many times before is going to convince someone who disagrees with you.

Stats don’t show half as much as you think. They’re just stats. They need to be interpreted, they are often interpreted incorrectly. The worst Karl Robinson teams usually underperformed their xG but everyone knew that was because opposition sides just rolled two 25-yard shots in after 20 minutes and then sat back whilst we tried to find Matty Taylor down the back of the sofa. Not because we were in some “false” position.

Manning teams regularly took the lead and then closed the game down, because they had a plan and a sense of purpose, the goalkeeper was the best player, and they were rapid on the counter attack. The aim is to win games, not xG.

I agree with that.

I also think that the football, particularly at home, was often boring and carried little in the way of entertainment.

Results are the most important thing, clearly, but his brand of football was bland.

Fair enough, we disagree.

 

[RgYellows]

Just my personal view of the chances of beating Bolton over two legs and then Barnsley or Peterborough at Wembley. If you take the view that the playoffs are a lottery so everyone has a 25% chance of winning we would have a one in eight chance of promotion. Maybe that's more realistic?

This year, I agree we are a long shot - but I wouldn’t extrapolate that over the next 20.

 

[Scrongo]

Jeezo...... Any one can be an outstanding manager ,15 games into a new season.

 

[SteMerritt]

If Manning stayed we’d of been comfortably in the play offs.

Who knows we could’ve challenged Pompey/Derby..

A lot of that would’ve been decided by how he got his January transfer window done.

I know it's not the most important take away from your post, but considering you've correctly contracted 'have' in "could've" and "would've", what the hell happened with "we'd of"???

 

[IsleofWightYellow]

But you come from the same class as Egg where anything less than positivity when things are good is totally unfathomable, ridiculous, laughable. If any one of the more critical posters had said what you’ve said while second in the league you’d have ridiculed them. But it’s ok now he’s a pantomime villain?

This is the exact problem with the so called ‘positive’ posters you mention who hide behind constantly posting absolute rubbish while saying ‘But I’m supporting the current manager!! Get behind the team!!! At least I’m better than the moaners?!’

If someone had posted saying that we were boring and they found us dull to watch under Manning while we were second, they’d have been shouted down by those posters. If someone had said we’re outperforming our XG they’d have been laughed at by those posters. If someone had said Manning isn’t a nice guy and they’d heard rumours the players don’t like him they’d have been absolutely ripped to shreds by those posters and called ‘negative’ etc etc etc.

However, as soon as Manning has gone and is no longer the manager, any positive comments about him are seen as ‘negative’ to the current management, so the rush is on to rewrite history and make up as much bad stuff as possible so the current debacle looks good. We saw exactly the same with Karl Robinson, he was blindly supported by these people for much longer than any sane fan would, and only at the very end was turned on. Des will be the same: If he’s sacked tomorrow and someone new comes in and somehow does even worse, we’ll be hearing about how ‘Yeah but Des had no chance of winning the playoffs and I’ve heard the players much prefer the new guy’ etc etc etc.

It’s honestly like watching Russian bots support Putin online, there’s zero objectivity or any kind of grasp on reality. It’s just as frustrating to me as someone who’s negative no matter what - it’s not based in reality so it’s a waste of time. Of course I’d rather have them cheering in the stands than people booing, but this isn’t the ground on matchday.

Of course they won’t ever accept this as they’re being ‘positive’ so therefore positive = a good thing. Boring.

 

[RgYellows]

Jeezo...... Any one can be an outstanding manager ,15 games into a new season.

KR always struggled with it

 

[Scrongo]

KR always struggled with it

AHH well Robbo was Robbo, a nearly man...

 

[TailsWeWin]

I also wonder how many points we've lost due to our best 11 not being available for large parts of the season, and especially from November onwards.

I always thought that our squad was particularly thin behind the first choice players. And that was long before Manning left. There seemed to be an acceptance when he arrived that it would take 3 windows to undo years of Robinson and his neglect to address some fundamental weaknesses while he massaged his own ego trying to resurrect numerous players careers....until he got bored of them that is.

Manning's failure to adequately address striking options being the most glaring issue. We've seen time and again over the years that it's a very difficult position to fill, so I'd cut him some slack on that front, but we were nowhere near being the finished article this season and we're particularly lacking much strength in depth.

If it's right that most of our January options were lined up prior to his departure, then maybe Goodwin was his signing all along. Great option on paper, but it hasn't worked out as we'd hoped from the start because we seemingly picked up an underlying issue that had gone undetected by Cheltenham. We nevertheless went ahead with the deal, probably because we thought it was something that could be overcome with the right rehabilitation and owing to his age. Maybe the final deal was changed to reflect this, which might explain why the deal took most of January to agree.

Anyway, I like the sound of the prediction up the thread that has us in 6th and Lincoln in 7th going into the final game. I fancy us to get more against Exeter than I do them against Pompey!

“Underlying issue undetected by Cheltenham…” Really? They knew Goodwin had an element of fragility and we therefore took a while to negotiate the deal. I don’t think we came out of that one well … but I hope Goodwin proves me wrong. At the moment Cheltenham are happy.
And our £400000 striker has scored ONE goal.

 

[Eric Blair]

I think people forget he guided us to safety the previous season too. Ok, we had a favourable run in and he perhaps should have been expected to but there was still a job to be done and he did it without too much drama. I certainly wasn’t blown away by his playing style this season, it wasn’t edge of your seat stuff, but it was yielding results. In my opinion, Manning was one of the clearest thinking and unmuddled, managers we’ve had in recent times.

His recruitment in the summer was good, he told us it would be done in good time and also said one or two would be last minute - everything fell nicely in to place. Come August the work over pre season was crystal clear and his mark was clearly imprinted on the team. His interviews were a bit bland but again there was a calmness and logic in pretty much everything he said.

His departure was untimely but I don’t blame him - it was a career move he couldn’t turn down. It may even have been one of those scenarios where he might even have wished Bristol City went away and didn’t give him a decision to make but once he was their man he was always off. Like you, I’d have him back tomorrow too.

I agree with all of this except your last sentence. I think his bridges are well and truly burnt with us - the speed of his departure and the alleged manner of his departure make it difficult for me (especially the former point). I dont wish him any malice but nor would I want him back. I cant think of many successful managerial returns.

Then again I'm an outlier on Des and think he needs time and a summer recruitment spell.

 

[Sheik djibouti]

I agree with all of this except your last sentence. I think his bridges are well and truly burnt with us - the speed of his departure and the alleged manner of his departure make it difficult for me (especially the former point). I dont wish him any malice but nor would I want him back. I cant think of many successful managerial returns.

Then again I'm an outlier on Des and think he needs time and a summer recruitment spell.

Did Manning ever hold that Teams meeting he promised to say goodbye to the players, seeing as he didn't do it in person

 

[Sheik djibouti]

“Underlying issue undetected by Cheltenham…” Really? They knew Goodwin had an element of fragility and we therefore took a while to negotiate the deal. I don’t think we came out of that one well … but I hope Goodwin proves me wrong. At the moment Cheltenham are happy.
And our £400000 striker has scored ONE goal.

Yep, pretty sure it was documented at the time that his quad injury was more significant than initially thought, or it was something Cheltenham hadn't picked up entirely. It's a pretty significant muscle group for a footballer to injure and if there's a deeper tear or bigger problem than Cheltenham had realised, then it might go some way to explain why it is being handled very carefully to make sure it heels properly and isn't aggravated by doing too much too soon.