National News Rishi Sunak

Essexyellows said:
Same Navy supporting shipping delivering humanitarian aid to............ ?
Same Navy protecting shipping from............. ?

Nope can`t see why they are there. :rolleyes:
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The Egyptian government own the Suez Canal Authority, which has an income from tolls of over 6 billion us dollars per annum, surely they should be responsible for security of shipping in the area.
 
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Essexyellows said:
That started in 1999? Quick check that was 25 years ago.

So they were 100% responsible for it? Just so we are clear?

And lets not forget who was in charge of the CPS when some cases were prosecuted............
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Please can you point to where I have apportioned 100% blame to any specific party on the Post Office issue?

The current government are to blame for inaction on this during their 14 years at the helm (and Lib Dems as part of the coalition), just as much as Labour are to blame for what did or did not happen during their time in power and just as much as Major's government (yes!) were to blame for signing off on the Fujitsu Horizon contract back in 1996. Nobody who allowed any of this to be perpetuated comes out well and all need to share the blame and apologise for any role they had. One might argue that as the evidence of a serious misacarriage of justice became more and more apparent, it became incumbent on the government of the day to act. The fact the Rishi et all KNEW exactly what had happened months/years before Toby Jones and ITV forced their hand and the groundswell of public anger that ensued, yet again demonstrates that they were willing to kick it into the long grass for as long as they possibly could if they didn't feel it might affect them at the ballot box....(now they can just add it to the long, long list of issues they are directly responsible for)

What is clear is, knowing what they did about Fujitsu and the Post Office as more and more came to light, Rishi as Chancellor continued to sign off somewhere around £4billion pounds worth of contracts from the public purse.

And are you really going with the SKS is to blame when he was head of CPS line? :ROFLMAO: That tactic worked well for the Tories with the Jimmy Saville case didn't it?

As I'm in a generous mood, here's an article to help with your education on the role of the CPS in Post Office prosecutions: https://www.standard.co.uk/news/pol...ice-cps-bury-greater-manchester-b1131948.html
You're welcome:)
 
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PottersRightBoot said:
Labour introduced Horizon.
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I think you'll find The Post Office did. And like every IT system I've ever worked with it had bugs. The problem was Fujitsu and/or The Post Office didn't admit to/resolve the bugs and both appear to have told blatant lies to individual MPs, parliament and the courts. How people at Fujitsu and The Post Office aren't behind bars God only knows! If you want to make it political then focus on the actions/inactions of individuals once the truth came out.
 
Initiated by Conservatives, run with by Labour and allowed to be rolled out despite huge concerns regarding reliability of an IT system plagued with flaws because no one wanted to upset Fujitsu or our relationship with Japan and way too much of tax payers money had already been spaffed on the unmitigated disaster to mothball it.

Sometimes prevention is better than cure. Desiderius Erasmus wasn’t wrong.

Sounds like a cock up by all concerned, across all parties. Labour should have been more robust in investigating the concerns and Conservative should have been more robust in dealing with the fallout. Instead, both allowed themselves to be lied to because quite frankly they didn’t want to face up to the problem or admit their shortcomings.

Impossible to ignore that this hadn’t become a political hot potato though, I mean, the Post Office was state owned.
 
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QR said:
I think you'll find The Post Office did. And like every IT system I've ever worked with it had bugs. The problem was Fujitsu and/or The Post Office didn't admit to/resolve the bugs and both appear to have told blatant lies to individual MPs, parliament and the courts. How people at Fujitsu and The Post Office aren't behind bars God only knows! If you want to make it political then focus on the actions/inactions of individuals once the truth came out.
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The individuals will, broadly speaking, be protected by the State & Contracts.

I very much doubt we will see prosecutions or jail sentences in the next 5,10 or 20 years.

As for multiple IT system cock ups across politics - Ladies & Gentlemen I give you "The NHS".
 
QR said:
I think you'll find The Post Office did. And like every IT system I've ever worked with it had bugs. The problem was Fujitsu and/or The Post Office didn't admit to/resolve the bugs and both appear to have told blatant lies to individual MPs, parliament and the courts. How people at Fujitsu and The Post Office aren't behind bars God only knows! If you want to make it political then focus on the actions/inactions of individuals once the truth came out.
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You’re blaming the Tories; you always do. Suggest you read the full history behind the woeful implementation and management of Horizon before you do.
 
MC Yellow said:
Initiated by Conservatives, run with by Labour and allowed to be rolled out despite huge concerns regarding reliability of an IT system plagued with flaws because no one wanted to upset Fujitsu or our relationship with Japan and way too much of tax payers money had already been spaffed on the unmitigated disaster to mothball it.

Sometimes prevention is better than cure. Desiderius Erasmus wasn’t wrong.

Sounds like a cock up by all concerned, across all parties. Labour should have been more robust in investigating the concerns and Conservative should have been more robust in dealing with the fallout. Instead, both allowed themselves to be lied to because quite frankly they didn’t want to face up to the problem or admit their shortcomings.

Impossible to ignore that this hadn’t become a political hot potato though, I mean, the Post Office was state owned.
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Horizon was introduced in 1999.
 
PottersRightBoot said:
Horizon was introduced in 1999.
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Horizon is the outcome of the Pathway project, whose procurement process commenced in August 1994, and was announced by social security minister Peter Lilley at the 1995 Conservative Party conference.

There are no points to be won over this from either of the two main parties.
 
I see the results of the latest combined Daily Telegraph/Yougov poll have been released. It is a massive one by normal standards in that it encompasses all bar the 18 NI constituencies and covered responses 14,000 people as opposed to the normal c2000 respondents. Based on this the results of a GE tomorrow would be as follows:

Labour: 385 MPs
Conservative: 169
Lib Dem: 48
Plaid Cymru: 3
Green: 1

It's only 1 poll, there's a long, long way to go to election day and no poll is ever 100% accurate, but still . . . that's John Major 1997 bloodbath territory.

And while the margins may tighten, they might also increase. Not impossible given the governments current performance and recent track record. It might be wise for Rishi to "take the L" (as the kids would say) right now, before it gets worse . . . .
 
PottersRightBoot said:
You’re blaming the Tories; you always do. Suggest you read the full history behind the woeful implementation and management of Horizon before you do.
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Blaming the Tories? I actually say 'The problem was Fujitsu and/or The Post Office didn't admit to/resolve the bugs and both appear to have told blatant lies to individual MPs, parliament and the courts. How people at Fujitsu and The Post Office aren't behind bars God only knows!'. Do you not read what I write??

I think all politicians were in a difficult situation until the truth came out. Believe me I detest Ed Davy more than any of the current Tory cabinet due to him selling his principles down the river to prop up the Tory's in 2010 for 15 minutes of fame and power, and even given that I have sympathy for him being on the end of sustained lies from The Post Office.
 
Not sure if any of you folk listen to the Rest Is Politics. Alistair Campbell was saying that Labour usually see a 7 point contraction in their polling during an election. In 1992 they were polling 5 points ahead at the beginning (and ended up 2 points below) and 1997 saw a similar 7 point drop (from a much higher starting point). I personally would love to see a big mandate for Labour but think it will be much much closer.
 
SteMerritt said:
Horizon is the outcome of the Pathway project, whose procurement process commenced in August 1994, and was announced by social security minister Peter Lilley at the 1995 Conservative Party conference.

There are no points to be won over this from either of the two main parties.
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Not sure about that . Which MP took up the cudgels on behalf of the sub-postmasters ?
 
PottersRightBoot said:
Not sure about that . Which MP took up the cudgels on behalf of the sub-postmasters ?
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There has been a Labour government who could have stopped this in its tracks, and a Tory government which could have acted at any time over the last 15 or so years before being forced into it because of a TV drama.

No winners or higher ground here.
 
QR said:
Blaming the Tories? I actually say 'The problem was Fujitsu and/or The Post Office didn't admit to/resolve the bugs and both appear to have told blatant lies to individual MPs, parliament and the courts. How people at Fujitsu and The Post Office aren't behind bars God only knows!'. Do you not read what I write??

I think all politicians were in a difficult situation until the truth came out. Believe me I detest Ed Davy more than any of the current Tory cabinet due to him selling his principles down the river to prop up the Tory's in 2010 for 15 minutes of fame and power, and even given that I have sympathy for him being on the end of sustained lies from The Post Office.
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As with so many issues, it’s too easy to blame it ALL on a government, past or present .
 
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