National News The Brexit Thread 🇬🇧🇪🇺

[Sheik djibouti]

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Well firstly there was that............. then several court cases and various tactics deployed by the "runners up". Can`t call them losers because everyone "wins" these days.

Then there was this..............
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They were interspaced by this...............
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Then Covid happened and things went a bit wobbly for every country in the world from an economic & logistical perspective......

Amazingly Germany, France & Spain are all reporting a shortage of HGV drivers...... but it`s "all coz of Brexit innit"

Driver shortage is pan-European | coldchainnews.com

Bath, UK: The logistics industry has been warning about driver shortages for many years but a combination of Covid-19, Brexit and the ongoing structural issues restricting the supply of drivers has brought us to a crisis point. In the UK there is a shortfall of at least 76,000 drivers. Across...

www.globalcoldchainnews.com

More acute here because they (European drivers) can no longer move freely and work here as before....so we have significantly narrowed the pool which we're fishing in....whereas Europe can share the problem.......

Amazing what you can achieve when you perpetuate a lie with Brexit isn't it? Once the die was cast with the leave vote, it was nly ever going to end that way....plenty of time to repent at leisure though....forty more years of this shitshow by your reckoning isn't it?

 

[Essexyellows]

More acute here because they (European drivers) can no longer move freely and work here as before....so we have significantly narrowed the pool which we're fishing in....whereas Europe can share the problem.......

Amazing what you can achieve when you perpetuate a lie with Brexit isn't it? Once the die was cast with the leave vote, it was nly ever going to end that way....plenty of time to repent at leisure though....forty more years of this shitshow by your reckoning isn't it?

Pour yourself a pint.....


Barring no Mcflurrys or Nando`s what else on the "We are doomed" list has happened?

 

[Marked Ox]

Pour yourself a pint.....
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Barring no Mcflurrys or Nando`s what else on the "We are doomed" list has happened?

Shortages in Supermarkets, 15k pigs being potentially wasted by being putdown rather than make it into the food chain, Diaries (such as Arla reducing deliveries) and difficulty in getting some meds for the NHS (I know this from personal experience)/Blood bottle shortage. Oh, and rising food prices which will hit the poorest disproportionately.

One positive is seeing Brexiteer Tim Martin crying about problems with Beer supplies and staff shortages though. This cheered me up no end with karma putting the boot in.

Edit: Oh, and proper/full customs checks on imports haven't started yet so that will add even further delays.

 

[Essexyellows]

Shortages in Supermarkets, 15k pigs being potentially wasted by being putdown rather than make it into the food chain, Diaries (such as Arla reducing deliveries) and difficulty in getting some meds for the NHS (I know this from personal experience)/Blood bottle shortage. Oh, and rising food prices which will hit the poorest disproportionately.

One positive is seeing Brexiteer Tim Martin crying about problems with Beer supplies and staff shortages though. This cheered me up no end with karma putting the boot in.

Edit: Oh, and proper/full customs checks on imports haven't started yet so that will add even further delays.

Pigs is actually 15k a week that need to move through the processing plants, I might need to come out of retirement!
Arla have downgraded the farmgate price for September. Surely that is just market forces? Lower demand from catering etc?
Blood bottle shortages aren`t purely Brexit - demand has been very high for a long time.
Food inflation? Not so sure on that based on personal experience or for a wider view.... https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/food-inflation
Meds do vary greatly in availability but most Trusts are helping each other out on that front, its also one of the weaknesses of the JIT supplychain but thats a whole new thread.

Tim Martin - oh dear, how sad, never mind.

 

[Marked Ox]

Pigs is actually 15k a week that need to move through the processing plants, I might need to come out of retirement!
Arla have downgraded the farmgate price for September. Surely that is just market forces? Lower demand from catering etc?
Blood bottle shortages aren`t purely Brexit - demand has been very high for a long time.
Food inflation? Not so sure on that based on personal experience or for a wider view.... https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/food-inflation
Meds do vary greatly in availability but most Trusts are helping each other out on that front, its also one of the weaknesses of the JIT supplychain but thats a whole new thread.

Tim Martin - oh dear, how sad, never mind.

Arla is down to the lack of HGV drivers and were one of the first to make changes.

Blood bottles are being made worse by Brexit through delivery, production issues.

No doubt the NHS supply chain needs some adaption, maybe increasing the storage safety net but Brexit is again making things worse. Oxford Hospitals never had trouble getting Taurolock before Brexit, now they can't get any and not for lack of trying.

Food prices are going to go up as costs are rising. As are building materials as demand is exceeding supply. Anecdotal admittedly but somebody self building has said breeze blocks in his area have almost doubled.

Of course, the same distribution/staff shortage problems will be affecting many others but we won't hear about it in small and medium sized businesses.

Although some of these problems if Johnson's Govt actually ignored their Brexit dogma and became pragmatic introducing temporary visas for Abattoir workers from the EU etc. They could move HGV drivers into the skilled worker category or enable temporary visas rather than . After all Brexiteers want to copy Australia who are supposed to base their numbers on what their economy need and we need HGV drivers* etc now.

*Whilst I don't disagree with the idea of training up HGV drivers from our own population, this isn't going to happen quickly being pushed by Brexiteers like John Redwood and the Govt, we need drivers now.

 

[SteMerritt]

Whilst I don't disagree with the idea of training up HGV drivers from our own population, this isn't going to happen quickly being pushed by Brexiteers like John Redwood and the Govt, we need drivers now.

What would be a concern, however, would be the process of becoming a qualified HGV Driver is simplified or streamlined to rush through new drivers at the expense of proper training. Hopefully this won't happen.

 

[QR]

So why aren't the Brexiteers who forever complained at 'foreigners coming over here taking our jobs', not now wanting their jobs back?

Come on you Brexiteers, stand up and be counted.

 

[Marked Ox]

What would be a concern, however, would be the process of becoming a qualified HGV Driver is simplified or streamlined to rush through new drivers at the expense of proper training. Hopefully this won't happen.

I fear it will happen. They've already extended allowable driving time in a shift.

 

[bashamwonderland]

Brexit only a small component of the 100,000 HGV driver shortage, with a pre-Covid shortage of 60,000 worsened by test delays and problems sourcing drivers across Europe.

Systematic problem we'd have had with or without Brexit.

Try again.

 

[Marked Ox]

Brexit only a small component of the 100,000 HGV driver shortage, with a pre-Covid shortage of 60,000 worsened by test delays and problems sourcing drivers across Europe.

Systematic problem we'd have had with or without Brexit.

Try again.

Brexit dogma is stopping the Govt being pragmatic and enabling temporary visas for EU citizens (or any others) for the immediate problem rather than the long term issue. I agree with the principle of training up from the UK population by the way. So it is very much a Brexit issue.

Try again.

 

[QR]

Brexit only a small component of the 100,000 HGV driver shortage, with a pre-Covid shortage of 60,000 worsened by test delays and problems sourcing drivers across Europe.

Systematic problem we'd have had with or without Brexit.

Try again.

So if we go with your figure of 60,000 shortage pre Covid what has this government been doing to help to resolve it? I've seen sweet fa. I hadn't heard it mentioned pre covid, so could you direct me to media reports at the time that flagged the issue?

I accept it isn't all for the government to resolve but they are a significant enabler.

 

[Sheik djibouti]

So if we go with your figure of 60,000 shortage pre Covid what has this government been doing to help to resolve it? I've seen sweet fa. I hadn't heard it mentioned pre covid, so could you direct me to media reports at the time that flagged the issue?

I accept it isn't all for the government to resolve but they are a significant enabler.

Yes...because supermarket and beer and fast food shortages have been commonplace for years and years haven't they?

Ergo the driver shortages previously there in the background were clearly manageable....and now they have reached a tipping point which manifests itself in supply shortages.

Still if it's pissing off that Weatherspoons weirdo, it's not all bad![emoji1787]

 

[bashamwonderland]

So if we go with your figure of 60,000 shortage pre Covid what has this government been doing to help to resolve it? I've seen sweet fa. I hadn't heard it mentioned pre covid, so could you direct me to media reports at the time that flagged the issue?

I accept it isn't all for the government to resolve but they are a significant enabler.

The 60,000 shortage isn't my figure.

How serious is the shortage of lorry drivers?

The industry says there's a shortage of 100,000 drivers but why is that and what is the likely impact?

www.bbc.co.uk

I can't point you towards media reports flagging the issue pre Covid because I don't know what the point of that exercise would be. I don't know what the government have been doing to resolve the issue and as someone who isn't a Tory I don't feel obliged to have an answer for that one.

Based on the figures available to me it would appear Brexit is actually a secondary factor in this driver shortage which is better explained by a. Systemic failures in the licencing system (possibly exacerbated by lack government foresight/action) and b. Global pandemic.

 

[MalaysiaYellow]

So why aren't the Brexiteers who forever complained at 'foreigners coming over here taking our jobs', not now wanting their jobs back?

Come on you Brexiteers, stand up and be counted.

Because they haven't got time as they are too busy on Football Forums sharing their views on Brexit......

 

[LowerSouth]

So if we go with your figure of 60,000 shortage pre Covid what has this government been doing to help to resolve it? I've seen sweet fa. I hadn't heard it mentioned pre covid, so could you direct me to media reports at the time that flagged the issue?

I accept it isn't all for the government to resolve but they are a significant enabler.

I see reports from Germany (BBCR4 news) of similar issues starting to arise there also.
A spokesman for the German hauliers highlighted how unattractive the industry is to new entrants etc etc.

 

[tonyw]

It's one of the extra annoyances of Covid, isn't it? Way down the list, but still there.

The hope was that 18 months after leaving the EU, and 8 months after the end of the transition period, we might have had some answers in the "Brexit : Good or Bad?" debate. Things would either be moving along smoothly as Brexiteers hoped, or everything would be going to hell as Remainers feared.

But then Covid has gone and ****ed everything up, and added so much noise to the data, that we can't really see the signal any more. Are the problems and shortages caused by Brexit and exacerbated by Covid - or are they Covid issues that were going to happen regardless of Britain's EU status?

Net result: No resolution to the Brexit debate in sight. Thanks Covid!

 

[Essexyellows]

So why aren't the Brexiteers who forever complained at 'foreigners coming over here taking our jobs', not now wanting their jobs back?

Come on you Brexiteers, stand up and be counted.

If I had any criticism of FOM it was the downward pressure on wages in the private sector.
Now any business will look at that as good and it reflects on all manner of things, such as cheaper products on shelves.
The flip side is that it makes the jobs less appealing to people, which is fine for 5 -10 years, then folk start retiring, others choose not to start.
Brexit happens, then a global pandemic arrives and folk go home and that is where the "system failure" kicks in.

What should not be forgotten is the element of exploitation of EU workers, if you want to live in a mouldy mobile home working 60+ hours a week for minimum wage (less accommodation costs) then crack on.
I would rather the job was paid properly to a decent standard and if that means a bag of carrots is £1.29 rather than 99p so be it.

 

[bashamwonderland]

If I had any criticism of FOM it was the downward pressure on wages in the private sector.
Now any business will look at that as good and it reflects on all manner of things, such as cheaper products on shelves.
The flip side is that it makes the jobs less appealing to people, which is fine for 5 -10 years, then folk start retiring, others choose not to start.
Brexit happens, then a global pandemic arrives and folk go home and that is where the "system failure" kicks in.

What should not be forgotten is the element of exploitation of EU workers, if you want to live in a mouldy mobile home working 60+ hours a week for minimum wage (less accommodation costs) then crack on.
I would rather the job was paid properly to a decent standard and if that means a bag of carrots is £1.29 rather than 99p so be it.

Yeah, considering we're all about eradicating modern day slavery, it's interesting that the remainers are upset that we no longer have portacabins and broken caravans filled with bunk beds housing our agricultural/manual labourers.

If we can correct wages, maybe then we can issue limited visas for Europeans to share the wealth.

It wasn't ethical to use eastern European slaves to do this work for us. Pay a bit more for food and maybe you can eat it with a clean conscience.

 

[MalaysiaYellow]

I would be curious, if someone did a Poll on here today, and asked if there was a referendum/vote on Brexit (remain/leave) today, what the result would be?

 

[QR]

Yeah, considering we're all about eradicating modern day slavery, it's interesting that the remainers are upset that we no longer have portacabins and broken caravans filled with bunk beds housing our agricultural/manual labourers.

If we can correct wages, maybe then we can issue limited visas for Europeans to share the wealth.

It wasn't ethical to use eastern European slaves to do this work for us. Pay a bit more for food and maybe you can eat it with a clean conscience.

Do me a favour coming over all woke all of a sudden. My heart's bleeding too much.

None of these issues were caused by the EU (just mercenary employers throughout the supply chain) and all could have been addressed via legislation if our government had the balls to enforce it's sovereignty!