National News Who next

[werthersoriginal]

Nope - it's all cutting one way at the moment and it is all a bag of shite
Businesses worse off with increased bureaucracy and cost
Jobs we can't fill
Productivity crisis
Frosty (at best) trading relationship with our nearest and biggest trading partners
Lack of any significant or ostensibly new trade deals (other than the "find and replace" job we did to substitute EU for UK in existing ones).


If you expect economic improvement from Brexit on a glacial timescale then I very much think our economy will be lagging in the doldrums for years to come whilst our "competitors" (that's what they are now, not partners) steal a march and desperate brexiteers scour the depths for any sign of positive news....

But hey, you probably won't be here, so what do you care

Ha, Kemi Badenoch suggested delaying net zero till 2060 or 2070, pointing out that 'we won't be here anyway'! Some really magisterial characters in the Tory party at the moment.

 

[tonyw]

So the final choice for the Tory party faithful is between someone who read PPE at Oxford, and someone who read PPE at Oxford.
This is after the three previous Tory Prime Ministers read Classics at Oxford, Geography at Oxford and PPE at Oxford respectively.

Always great to see a wide range of educational backgrounds and perspectives being represented in our leadership.


[for what it's worth, I hope Rishi wins. Not because I have any excitement whatsoever in seeing him as Prime Minister. But he does at least seem halfway sane and at least slightly pragmatic.......]

 

[werthersoriginal]

So the final choice for the Tory party faithful is between someone who read PPE at Oxford, and someone who read PPE at Oxford.
This is after the three previous Tory Prime Ministers read Classics at Oxford, Geography at Oxford and PPE at Oxford respectively.

Always great to see a wide range of educational backgrounds and perspectives being represented in our leadership.


[for what it's worth, I hope Rishi wins. Not because I have any excitement whatsoever in seeing him as Prime Minister. But he does at least seem halfway sane and at least slightly pragmatic.......]

Yeah what’s wrong with Cambridge?

 

[Marked Ox]

Yeah what’s wrong with Cambridge?

They're splitters.

 

[Essexyellows]

Nope - it's all cutting one way at the moment and it is all a bag of shite
Businesses worse off with increased bureaucracy and cost
Jobs we can't fill
Productivity crisis
Frosty (at best) trading relationship with our nearest and biggest trading partners
Lack of any significant or ostensibly new trade deals (other than the "find and replace" job we did to substitute EU for UK in existing ones).


If you expect economic improvement from Brexit on a glacial timescale then I very much think our economy will be lagging in the doldrums for years to come whilst our "competitors" (that's what they are now, not partners) steal a march and desperate brexiteers scour the depths for any sign of positive news....

But hey, you probably won't be here, so what do you care

And for balance its made diddly difference to our lives, or that of our neighbours.

Productivity crisis? That`ll be the lazy gits WFH......

Trade deals? https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-trade-agreements-with-non-eu-countries

Cyclical economies have ups & downs, if this is a down then things aren`t too bad for the majority.

 

[38yearsofpain]

And for balance its made diddly difference to our lives, or that of our neighbours.

Productivity crisis? That`ll be the lazy gits WFH......

Trade deals? https://www.gov.uk/guidance/uk-trade-agreements-with-non-eu-countries

Cyclical economies have ups & downs, if this is a down then things aren`t too bad for the majority.

Yeah if a million kids don't get enough to eat who gives a s**t, they will never vote Tory will they. We established all those charity food banks to cover up the economic failures of the last 12 years.

 

[Oslernorth]

Maybe because getting the benefit after 40+ years of evolution, embedding and entwinement will take time to resolve?

The benefits of Brexit won’t be realised for a hundred or so years, I think we’re all coming to terms with that.
That shouldn’t stop Liz Truss’s ability to explain her thought process in what changed her mind over Brexit. As long as she’s not just being a huge opportunists that stands for nothing but her own advancement?

 

[stokeu]

She has a thought process?

 

[Essexyellows]

Yeah if a million kids don't get enough to eat who gives a s**t, they will never vote Tory will they. We established all those charity food banks to cover up the economic failures of the last 12 years.

We`ve had foodbanks since 2000 under Blair so it's a bit more than 12 years.

They are a fantastic resource that both help people and reduces food waste.

Broadly speaking the people they help have been failed in some way, either by their own parents, the state, or themselves (education/health/opportunity).

Our local FB has also seen an increase in referrals where both parents work, in poorly paid jobs, and their income is insufficient to cover their outgoings.

The biggest draw on their outgoings is servicing debt - that goes back to education or lack of life skills.

I would say it's a Government societal failure more than an economic one - the decline/demise of taught Home Economics in schools was/is an unmitigated disaster.

If you have lived your early life as a hungry kid you learn from it, if you are a decent person you share that knowledge.*

*awaits inevitable abuse for sharing life experiences as the child in a one-parent family when there weren`t any foodbanks and neighbours shared/chipped in

 

[OUFCGav]

We`ve had foodbanks since 2000 under Blair so it's a bit more than 12 years.

They are a fantastic resource that both help people and reduces food waste.

Broadly speaking the people they help have been failed in some way, either by their own parents, the state, or themselves (education/health/opportunity).

Our local FB has also seen an increase in referrals where both parents work, in poorly paid jobs, and their income is insufficient to cover their outgoings.

The biggest draw on their outgoings is servicing debt - that goes back to education or lack of life skills.

I would say it's a Government societal failure more than an economic one - the decline/demise of taught Home Economics in schools was/is an unmitigated disaster.

If you have lived your early life as a hungry kid you learn from it, if you are a decent person you share that knowledge.*

*awaits inevitable abuse for sharing life experiences as the child in a one-parent family when there weren`t any foodbanks and neighbours shared/chipped in

Yes they existed, but in no-where near the numbers. In 2008/9 there were approx 26000 users, 2011/12 127000 users, 2013/14 that jumped to 913000, 2020/21 up to 2500000 users.

 

[Marked Ox]

We`ve had foodbanks since 2000 under Blair so it's a bit more than 12 years.

They are a fantastic resource that both help people and reduces food waste.

Broadly speaking the people they help have been failed in some way, either by their own parents, the state, or themselves (education/health/opportunity).

Our local FB has also seen an increase in referrals where both parents work, in poorly paid jobs, and their income is insufficient to cover their outgoings.

The biggest draw on their outgoings is servicing debt - that goes back to education or lack of life skills.

I would say it's a Government societal failure more than an economic one - the decline/demise of taught Home Economics in schools was/is an unmitigated disaster.

If you have lived your early life as a hungry kid you learn from it, if you are a decent person you share that knowledge.*

*awaits inevitable abuse for sharing life experiences as the child in a one-parent family when there weren`t any foodbanks and neighbours shared/chipped in

Wow. We shouldn't need them at all.

And the bit about Blair rather misses the very rapid growth of food banks/referrals under the Tories:

UK foodbank users 2023 | Statista

In 2022/23 approximately 2.99 million people used a foodbank in the United Kingdom, an increase when compared with the previous year.

www.statista.com

These figures are only for the Trussell Trust.

 

[Marked Ox]

This is what Truss and Sunak should be talking about, their plans to counter.

 

[38yearsofpain]

We`ve had foodbanks since 2000 under Blair so it's a bit more than 12 years.

They are a fantastic resource that both help people and reduces food waste.

Broadly speaking the people they help have been failed in some way, either by their own parents, the state, or themselves (education/health/opportunity).

Our local FB has also seen an increase in referrals where both parents work, in poorly paid jobs, and their income is insufficient to cover their outgoings.

The biggest draw on their outgoings is servicing debt - that goes back to education or lack of life skills.

I would say it's a Government societal failure more than an economic one - the decline/demise of taught Home Economics in schools was/is an unmitigated disaster.

If you have lived your early life as a hungry kid you learn from it, if you are a decent person you share that knowledge.*

*awaits inevitable abuse for sharing life experiences as the child in a one-parent family when there weren`t any foodbanks and neighbours shared/chipped in

Yeah I remember the hungry kid syndrome as well and not sure that is the best way of learning life lessons. Unfortunstely for every one who succeeds another 99 don't.
My major point is politicians of both parties have let the poorest members of society down. They don't appear to care, they posture a bit but the undeniable truth is they fail. It is not exclusive to the UK but that is equally irrelevant. In essence if you are not target voter we dont really care. Just leave it to charities and well meaning people and they can ignore it until people P**s in their or their voters yard.

 

[Essexyellows]

Wow. We shouldn't need them at all.

And the bit about Blair rather misses the very rapid growth of food banks/referrals under the Tories:

UK foodbank users 2023 | Statista

In 2022/23 approximately 2.99 million people used a foodbank in the United Kingdom, an increase when compared with the previous year.

www.statista.com

These figures are only for the Trussell Trust.

Before they were a thing it happened "off the radar". Families would help each other out as best they could, kids still missed meals and suffered the ignomy of having a booklet of free school dinner vouchers so everyone knew you were "poor".

However, as "we shouldn`t need them at all" (a point I can agree with to a degree) what is your alternative?

The problems aren`t going away, people are saddled by rising fuel costs (global issue), rising debt repayments (personal choice) stagnant salaries (lack of skills to progress) or reduced spending power (global food markets/inflation).

One of our local FBs has been impacted by costs, and is now a "nonprofit" shop where folk pay for their previously free basket of food, is that progression or a retrograde step?

You can go in there now and get a weekly shop that might be £50 in a supermarket for about £20-£25, it has more choice, better quality and people still need a referral....... is it educating people to budget? Is it helping people out of a sticky patch? Or should it be shut down and its customers packed off to Tesco with a bundle of food vouchers?

 

[Marked Ox]

Before they were a thing it happened "off the radar". Families would help each other out as best they could, kids still missed meals and suffered the ignomy of having a booklet of free school dinner vouchers so everyone knew you were "poor".

However, as "we shouldn`t need them at all" (a point I can agree with to a degree) what is your alternative?

The problems aren`t going away, people are saddled by rising fuel costs (global issue), rising debt repayments (personal choice) stagnant salaries (lack of skills to progress) or reduced spending power (global food markets/inflation).

One of our local FBs has been impacted by costs, and is now a "nonprofit" shop where folk pay for their previously free basket of food, is that progression or a retrograde step?

You can go in there now and get a weekly shop that might be £50 in a supermarket for about £20-£25, it has more choice, better quality and people still need a referral....... is it educating people to budget? Is it helping people out of a sticky patch? Or should it be shut down and its customers packed off to Tesco with a bundle of food vouchers?

I'm not saying it didn't happen but are you suggesting over 2m food bank users (and their families) were helped out on a regular basis back then?

How about a decent living wage? How about not proposing another real terms cut on public sector workers after many years of pay freezes or previous below inflation pay rises?

 

[QR]

I'm not saying it didn't happen but are you suggesting over 2m food bank users (and their families) were helped out on a regular basis back then?

How about a decent living wage? How about not proposing another real terms cut on public sector workers after many years of pay freezes or previous below inflation pay rises?

And how about stopping the friends of the Tories ripping off the public purse and preventing the hording of wealth in tax havens. Something Richi knows a lot about so I've heard.

There would be a bit more to go round then.

 

[Essexyellows]

I'm not saying it didn't happen but are you suggesting over 2m food bank users (and their families) were helped out on a regular basis back then?

How about a decent living wage? How about not proposing another real terms cut on public sector workers after many years of pay freezes or previous below inflation pay rises?

The population has increased by more than 10 million since the mid 60`s.

Who will pay for the "decent living wage" ?

The alleged real terms pay cut in the public sector "forgets" to add in increments that PS employees get as well as the cost of living pay rise.

 

[SteMerritt]

Who will pay for the "decent living wage" ?

Whoah, it's just 000's on a spreadsheet when the government P**s it up against a wall, but when it's to be spent on something that will make a difference suddenly you are worried about who is paying?

 

[IsleofWightYellow]

Don’t worry about money - as Liz has said we can just borrow whatever we want, and as other countries have more debt than us it’s fine!!!

 

[Peterdev]

A build up debt can be justified but with higher interest rates that will cost